EarnByLoaning - earnbyloaning.com

[jlpicard]

Originally Posted by epaydayTG

Hi Mishugenan,

I believe it is temporary.

"Because we do not know the exact date of the new site launch, we are going to have a NEW PLP in place temporarily"

Ref:
https://earnbyloaning.com/forum/view...hp?p=1371#1371

In the same thread, EBL_2 (admin) asks if the Member's would like to keep this plan.

Ref:
https://earnbyloaning.com/forum/view...hp?p=1394#1394

I agree that it will be temporary... but we're just speculating at this point.

Originally Posted by epaydayTG

Just a quick question for members:
would this type of funding we have for the New plan, be more or less acceptable to use, even though the rates have been reduced a bit?
OR, would you rather see the same type of plans previously?

IMHO, the new plan invites abuse. You can get paid monthly if you setup a new loan every month for 4 months. I do not really care if they lower the rate to 50% instead of 66% return for a 120 day loan. As long as the monthly rate is above 1% per month and I can "trust" the program, I can make it work for me.

I think you're right about the abuse potential as well...

Originally Posted by epaydayTG

As far as the 5 loans limit, I believe CJ is limiting growth to get funds in place to do what he does. I think you can get 5 loans per plan but I'm not sure???

That's also my understanding, but I'll bet the rule will be changed if they start to see 5 loans in every plan...

Eventually, CJ will learn what Greg already has learned and simplify/reduce the number of plans and raise the minimum. We've talked about this privately - $50 is a joke for this kind of program... I think the sentiment of wanting to help the little guy is great, but allowing $50 loans is not going to help anyone very much and it's going to cause them more grief than it's worth IMHO.
.

[4loan]

Originally Posted by epaydayTG

Hi Mishugenan,

I believe it is temporary.

"Because we do not know the exact date of the new site launch, we are going to have a NEW PLP in place temporarily"
....

As far as the 5 loans limit, I believe CJ is limiting growth to get funds in place to do what he does. I think you can get 5 loans per plan but I'm not sure???

I have confirmation from EBL support that the new plan is temporary, until the new site is up.

Also, there is limit of 5 loans max, TOTAL. This includes any existing 120 days members may have in place already. Here is the quote from the original announcement:

Remember, this is temporary until the new site is up.
You can have 5 total loans at any one time with up to 10k per loan.
EG: $10k, 10k, 10k, 10k, 10k.

You will need a seperate contract for each loan.

Any members who have CURRENT 120 day loans fall under this category as well.
For ex: If you have 3 x 120 day loans active in the old system,then you can only Have 2 new loans in this new PLP.
This does not include 365 day loans, they are separate.

Read my next post for more details.

[4loan]

Originally Posted by jlpicard

I do not know if the lowering of the 120 day plan will be permanent or not. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I think that they are 'testing the waters'. I recommend that you weigh in on the discussion so that you input is heard.

If you haven't read this post:

https://earnbyloaning.com/forum/view...?t=297&start=0

I recommend that you do.

I would guess that most people are more interested in compounding than cash flow like yourself. I saw this preference in L and I'm seeing it with EBL as well. What Craig seems to be doing is limiting the amount you can loan them to $50K. Personally, I'm laddering in $20k in four steps of $5k each and compounding at 50% until I reach $50k and then I just keep five loans of $10k out there and take cash flow from then on.

Thing is... I'll bet there will changes between now and the time I turn my $20k in to $50k so this is only my current plan.

Everyone has different objectives, but I've posted many times that I'm NOT a big fan of 100% compounding for long periods of time. These programs all carry higher than average risk and taking at least some cash flow lowers ones chance of loss. Why not take some cash flow and invest it somewhere else?
.

The new loan structure is definitely temporary.

Although members have shown an interest in compounding, EBL has no intention to ever make this an option.

See my next post for details.

[4loan]

Last night (Tues), here was an impromptu online conference call discussion using the new software EBL announced in the forum. A select few that were available were invited to participate to discuss thoughts about the new loan structure and other ideas.

There was a lot discussed. The essence of what was shared was what is likely to change and what is not. Keep in mind that what I share is not set in stone, as they are still tweaking the options for the new site, and is also my own understanding.

EBL has certain goals they are trying to achieve with regards to how the program is structured. By that I mean that they want to make sure funds are distributed across all loan plans in a way that will support the longevity of the program. They have indicated that there will be minor adjustments to rates, caps, and number of loans in different levels. For example, there will probably be a decrease in the number of loans permitted at the low end (30 day plans).

So, yes, they are testing the waters to see what members like, weighed against the needs of the program (and it was confirmed that under the current structure the max is 5 x 120 day loans TOTAL).

Most changes are not expected to be drastic, just different. But as mishugenah said "...nothing is ever going to give us everything, is it ..."

But I'm sure whatever they offer will continue to be very attractive and overall will please the membership. One thing mentioned is that they feel quite confident of the way the program is operating that they don't anticipate the need to ever have to provide less than double digit returns per month (not a promise, just their expectation).

They also made it very clear that they have no interest in providing a compounding option. Interest offerings will be simple interest only during the term of any loan.

That said, they talked about eventually having a new VIP program, that they have mentioned before, that will have more flexibility, and will probably be by invitation only, e.g, access to interest, but will involve certain commitments.

They also plan to have a demo of the new site shortly before it launches to get members familiar with the basics; set-up, funding loans, etc and any new functionality they are planning.

I did point out that one of the things I thought many members were interested in was visibility and adequate advanced warning to changes so members could plan accordingly.

Everyone on the call agreed that whatever changes are made to the program are likely to be well received if it means the continued sustainability of the program (and there is reasonable advanced notice that does not jeopardize the program).

There may have been other things mentioned but that is what comes to mind. We'll just have to wait till the new site is ready before we find out the final details. For now, they do not intend to make any further changes to the plans until the new site is up.

[in3worlds]

I was on that call last night, and 4loan's synopsis is a good one.

We'll have to wait and see what the final percentages and loan limits may or may not be with the launch of the new site.

Answer to picard's annualized interest on the 120 day loans:

At 1.66 per 120 day, 3 terms of 120 days = 4.574296 - 1.00 (principal) = 357.43% A bit more with the extra 5 days in the calendar year.

At 1.50 per 120 day, 3 terms of 120 days = 3.375 - 1.00 (principal) = 237.5% per year. A bit more with the extra 5 days in the calendar year. (This calculation was run the same as the prior program because ebl has said you cannot compound your 60 day interest back into the loan for increased interest.)

Thanks,
Martin

[jlpicard]

Originally Posted by 4loan

Last night (Tues), here was an impromptu online conference call discussion using the new software EBL announced in the forum. A select few that were available were invited to participate to discuss thoughts about the new loan structure and other ideas.

There was a lot discussed. The essence of what was shared was what is likely to change and what is not. Keep in mind that what I share is not set in stone, as they are still tweaking the options for the new site, and is also my own understanding.

EBL has certain goals they are trying to achieve with regards to how the program is structured. By that I mean that they want to make sure funds are distributed across all loan plans in a way that will support the longevity of the program. They have indicated that there will be minor adjustments to rates, caps, and number of loans in different levels. For example, there will probably be a decrease in the number of loans permitted at the low end (30 day plans).

So, yes, they are testing the waters to see what members like, weighed against the needs of the program (and it was confirmed that under the current structure the max is 5 x 120 day loans TOTAL).

Most changes are not expected to be drastic, just different. But as mishugenah said "...nothing is ever going to give us everything, is it ..."

But I'm sure whatever they offer will continue to be very attractive and overall will please the membership. One thing mentioned is that they feel quite confident of the way the program is operating that they don't anticipate the need to ever have to provide less than double digit returns per month (not a promise, just their expectation).

They also made it very clear that they have no interest in providing a compounding option. Interest offerings will be simple interest only during the term of any loan.

That said, they talked about eventually having a new VIP program, that they have mentioned before, that will have more flexibility, and will probably be by invitation only, e.g, access to interest, but will involve certain commitments.

They also plan to have a demo of the new site shortly before it launches to get members familiar with the basics; set-up, funding loans, etc and any new functionality they are planning.

I did point out that one of the things I thought many members were interested in was visibility and adequate advanced warning to changes so members could plan accordingly.

Everyone on the call agreed that whatever changes are made to the program are likely to be well received if it means the continued sustainability of the program (and there is reasonable advanced notice that does not jeopardize the program).

There may have been other things mentioned but that is what comes to mind. We'll just have to wait till the new site is ready before we find out the final details. For now, they do not intend to make any further changes to the plans until the new site is up.

This is similar to what CJ discussed in Las Vegas. He did not mention the demo at the time. I suspect this was because they expected to have it finished by July 4th at the time we met with them.

He also mentioned the new VIP program, but like it was then, there were no specifics about this program and there still aren't, so I don't think it's a fruitful discussion topic at this point.

As I mentioned in earlier posts, they are testing the waters. One really didn't need to be on the conference call to know this (I was not). This post on the forum from CJ (admin) indicated this:

https://earnbyloaning.com/forum/view...?t=297&start=0

See the last post at the bottom of the page.

@ Martin - I'll show you what I got and how shortly.
.

[jlpicard]

Originally Posted by jlpicard

How does everyone feel about the new 120 day program?

The daily rate works out to be 0.4167% per day vs. 0.5500% on the old PLP 2-4, but you get access to interest after 60 days with the new on vs. 120 days in the old one.

The cash flow diagram for the old program looks like this:



and the new one looks like this:



O.k., I'm a teacher at heart, so here is the assignment for the day... What is the annualized return for each program?

Hint: You will need a financial calculator or know how to use the financial functions on your favorite spread sheet to calculate this (unless of course you are mathematical animal...).

Have fun! (BTW, the education section of my new website will explain how this works in an easy to understand format.)
.

Here is what I get. Starting with the old PLP 2-4, I assume that you take cash every 4 months and reloan the principal. If you did this with $1000, the cash flow diagram would look like this:



I was mistaken earlier, you don't need a financial calculator to do this, but if you were to do this the proper way, you'd put the following into your financial calculator or spread sheet function:

N = 3 (4 month) periods
PV (present value) = -1000.00
PMT (period payment) = 660.00
FV (future value) = +1000.00

Solving for I (interest rate) gives you 66% per 4 month period (which you could've gotten without a calculator). To get the annualized rate, we multiply this by 3 to get 198%

Now for the new program. Using the same assumptions as in the previous example, the cash flow diagram looks like this:



The parameters for this program look like this:

N = 6 (2 month) periods
PV (present value) = -1000.00
PMT (period payment) = 250.00
FV (future value) = +1000.00

Solving for I (interest rate) gives you 25% per 2 month period (again, which you could've gotten without a calculator). To get the annualized rate, we multiply this by 6 to get 150%

I used to buy and sell private notes and this is how we would do these calculations.
.

[mishugenah]

LOL JLP! the point being its still less, will always be less, and there's no way you can configure it to make it more than less! And (as an aside) 10k max is always going to give you less income than 25k max...maybe I'm just not using the rocket scientist approach.

Sorry, I just find it a little comical. In my underused mind .66 is still more than .50 and there is nothing that can convince me otherwise. YMMV

[jlpicard]

Originally Posted by mishugenah

LOL JLP! the point being its still less, will always be less, and there's no way you can configure it to make it more than less! And (as an aside) 10k max is always going to give you less income than 25k max...maybe I'm just not using the rocket scientist approach.

Sorry, I just find it a little comical. In my underused mind .66 is still more than .50 and there is nothing that can convince me otherwise. YMMV

You and many other only see .66% vs. .50%... The other dimension is time which most people don't consider.

I can give you an example that actually pays you more at the end of 1 year, but still has a lower rate of return. And how could that be and why is it important?... Now that's the question all smart investor should ask themselves! IMHO, most people don't understand (or at least well enough) how time enters the picture. Because of this lack of understanding, many of the folks I used to compete with in the note business took advantage of those that didn't really grok this concept (one of the reasons I left the business... I couldn't operate that way...).

Would you like to see the example I alluded to and why it's important?

I ask this because it takes time to pull these examples together. I used to teach this stuff a few years ago.
.

[mishugenah]

Originally Posted by jlpicard

You and many other only see .66% vs. .50%... The other dimension is time which most people don't consider.

I can give you an example that actually pays you more at the end of 1 year, but still has a lower rate of return. And how could that be and why is it important?... Now that's the question all smart investor should ask themselves! IMHO, most people don't understand (or at least well enough) how time enters the picture. Because of this lack of understanding, many of the folks I used to compete with in the note business took advantage of those that didn't really grok this concept (one of the reasons I left the business... I couldn't operate that way...).

Would you like to see the example I alluded to and why it's important?

I ask this because it takes time to pull these examples together. I used to teach this stuff a few years ago.
.

Absolutely, JLP - and I do believe in the value of time, and do know why sometimes less can be more in the long run, I just don't see it here - show me, please. I can't help but consider the fact that you can't roll this early interest back in without first taking it as a withdrawal. Also that the ceiling has been lowered.